Penguin Watch Talk

Hello, Penguin Watch!

  • DZM by DZM admin

    Hello, Penguin Watch Zooites! I wanted to stop by and introduce myself…

    My name is Darren--DZM here on Talk--and I've just joined the Zooniverse team. I'm working on a few projects, first and foremost an overhaul of the Talk system. In particular, I’m interested in working to build a unified Zooniverse Talk within which individual project forums are nested.

    I don’t have any sort of ornithological, zoological, or other scientific background, but I’m hoping to learn from everyone here! I’ll be around these boards as often as possible, looking for any other ways in which I can help out, so I’m always interested in hearing from you--questions, concerns, ideas, anything.

    In particular, if you have any additional ideas for how Talk can be improved, I'd love to know!

    See you all around!

    DZM

    Posted

  • racegirlj by racegirlj

    Hi Darren and welcome! Hope you enjoy working at the Zooniverse. Thanks in advance for your hard work to make it better.

    Jaymee (a.k.a. racegirlj)
    Fairfield, California

    Posted

  • DZM by DZM admin

    Hi Jaymee! Thank you for the welcome; nice to meet you! I do love this awesome Penguin Watch place... sometimes there are just so many penguins in a picture. Sooooo many! 😃

    Posted

  • BellisP by BellisP

    Hello Darren welcome and so glad you are enjoying it so far
    Ideas wise, perhaps the discussion board section could be made a bit more intuitive/welcoming. People use the post-classification comments much much more than the boards which are tucked away a bit.
    Good luck, BP

    Posted

  • Nickypeng by Nickypeng moderator

    I agree with BP - when I started I didn't realise the discussion boards were there so just used the comments. And I'm still not sure where is the best place to put which sorts of comments.
    Also maybe it would be worth having a separate place for technical "Help" questions (like I can't sign in; this isn't working properly etc) - separate from discussion/questions/comments about penguins etc.
    I had some problems initially and it wasn't apparent to me where to look for help.
    Will let you know if we think of other things
    Nicky & Peng

    Posted

  • Nickypeng by Nickypeng moderator

    Another thought - a mechanism for the moderators to give information to users might also be worth having. There was an issue early in the Penguin project with it not working on Internet Explorer - the moderators must have got really sick of repeating themselves having to respond to dozens of comments on this issue.
    Also on this one http://talk.penguinwatch.org/#/subjects/APZ0001lcc the moderator has asked a question that is obviously directed to all Penguin Watchers but its in the comments to one particular picture so lots of people will miss it.
    N&P

    Posted

  • DZM by DZM admin

    @BellisP and @Nickypeng, yes, I had the same reaction the first time I tried to use Talk... I couldn't even find the discussion fora right away!

    Excellent point about needing a way for mods to address all users, too. I know that the "object comments" is a major feature of Talk that is very useful for the scientists, but it shouldn't come at the expense of longer-form discussion.

    Thank you both!

    Posted

  • Nickypeng by Nickypeng moderator

    Darren - Following on from my earlier comment about providing “help” - I have now realise that there is a Help discussion board - but I’m not the only one who hasn’t found it because people put most of their questions in the photo comments.
    Anyway – I am not sure that having the help on the discussion board is the best place for it. At least for dealing with FAQs, it would be helpful if a link to this was provided at the point where the questions arise.
    This will vary for different projects, but with the penguins for example, it is when you are on the classify page that you want to know what to do if you can’t tell if they are adults or chicks, or if there are penguins present but the picture is too blurry to count them, or if there is something else that isn’t on the “other” list (like a vulture or a reindeer -and yes, there are some).
    If there was an FAQ button somewhere obvious on the classify page (like, just below the OK button) that would help users and assuming it was set up so the moderators could update it as questions arose, they would only have to answer each question once.

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator

    Hi Nicky & Peng,

    I may be wrong, but I consider the Help discussion board to be focused on technical problems like reporting bugs rather than helping users in other ways; the science board focused on understanding of the project's goals or understanding the animal behavior and so on; and the Chat board for all other stuff. So the questions What to do if the image is too blurry or how to recognize a chick (that you have mentioned) belong to the Science discussion board.

    Anyway, I got your point and I agree that it is not the best solution since it doesn't work properly, users are confused and nobody know where to look for the answers. You'r right that the answers should be easily accessible from the classification page. I like your suggestion with the FAQ button there 😃

    I have many own suggestions about how to improve the talk. I'm glad I'm not alone and I'm really happy that we have an opportunity to share our ideas with the Zooniverse team!

    Zuzi

    Posted

  • BellisP by BellisP

    Hello again. FAQs sound like a good idea!
    Quick thought about discussion boards. What to do if you want to talk about something which is not directly related to a single object? All three areas have a section called "The Objects", but none of them have a "Not the Objects" section? is that common to all the Zooniverse projects or just the way Penguinwatch is set up?
    And if the subheadings can be changed, then perhaps they could/should be labelled to fit with what @yshish says above about what goes where?
    BP

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator

    Hi Bellis,

    It is the same set up of the discussion board for all the projects which use this form of the talk page. When you enter the Discussion board page [the top menu - 3rd option] there is a button 'Start a new [help*] board' for each discussion category [on the right]. I think you can create new discussion board instead of the 'Object' one here, even when you're not a moderator, but not sure. Please, tell me. Thank you!

    Z.

    *help / science / chat

    Posted

  • BellisP by BellisP

    hello again! those options don't seem to be there for ordinary users. the only things you can click on in those 3 main sections is "the objects" to open up that bit, or the name of last poster to open up their profile.

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator

    OK, so this is probably just for the moderators/scientists. Thanks.

    Posted

  • DZM by DZM admin

    If anyone would like to know a bit more about me and my role, there's a new Zooniverse blog post up from Chris Lintott introducing me.

    Feel free to check it out, and I'm happy to answer any additional questions that you might have! 😃

    Posted

  • DrJuliaG by DrJuliaG

    Why hasn't the blog been updated since day 4? I'd like some feedback on how well the project is going, even qualitatively. Is the classification really helping the team? Or is it primarily a PR exercise? I'd like to know if there is some measure for how successful I am for example; I don't feel completely confident always in distinguishing between adults and chicks.
    Julia

    Posted

  • DZM by DZM admin

    Hi @DrJuliaG, the cool thing about citizen science is that even if we're clueless (and I generally am, as well, about adults and chicks), putting together the guesses of many clueless people tends to produce the right answer! So don't worry too much if you're taking guesses occasionally. 😃

    I am hoping we'll hear a bit more from the science team sometime soon, but I an also promise that no matter what, classifying helps. Even if for some reason the science team does nothing with the data, at the end of the day, it will eventually all be open-sourced so that anyone can have a crack! So you are definitely helping!

    Posted

  • PenguinHila by PenguinHila scientist, translator

    @DrJuliaG we promise the data will be used! Most of our team is currently down south, setting up over 20 new cameras already this season. Because our field season is well underway from October-February, it's a great time for all of the data from the past 3 years to be processed by you, the citizen scientists, so that hopefully we can achieve the machine learning goals that the Zooniverse Team and our computer scientists are working hard to develop. In the future we will have so much more data, that we hope the computers will be able to process it for us. We hope to have some more news out soon, but it will take some more images being classified before we get to a better point to understand the success of the project. Thanks again for participating!

    Posted

  • DZM by DZM admin

    Thanks for checking in, @PenguinHila! There are definitely people working hard on the classifications here.

    It's always really helpful for our volunteers to have the science team check in and answer questions, so if you ever get a break between field work, please do occasionally pay us a visit like this on Talk! 😃

    Posted

  • Pennsfan by Pennsfan

    Hello everyone. Just signed up--heard about the project on ATC on NPR. Accidentally started looking for penguins /before/ singing up formally. First shot, frozen wasteland, second shot was more of the critters than I could count. Hillside after hillside with penguins packed tight. Don't think I have the eyesight to accurately mark the individuals in that shot. Is there a way to estimate the number of penguins in that situation?

    I find the boards a bit confusing as newbie, but I'll keep trying. I hope the image got kicked back to someone who knew what they were doing. Perhaps this should have been posted on the science board?

    It will get sorted. Nice to join in with the watch!

    Posted

  • Bonnie123 by Bonnie123 in response to Pennsfan's comment.

    To Pennsfan: They like us to try to count at least 30 penguins, after that you receive the pop up and you can continue to count as many penguins as you would like. For a photo like you mention I normally count as many as I can and then I click on one of the penguins out in the distance and finish. I could be wrong but it seems to let the computer or whoever know that they need to make that part of the photo larger and send it out again. If your photo was the one with the thousands of penguins, trust me when I say you will be seeing a lot more of that photo, just count as many as you would like. Hope this helps.

    Posted

  • tunon by tunon

    Could a magnification feature be added on the initial page with the penguins? Sometimes I would like to check a small object before deciding whether to select Yes/No/Can't tell. Thanks, Johanna

    Posted

  • MonarchRaiser by MonarchRaiser in response to Nickypeng's comment.

    Yes yes, we need an FAQ link!

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator in response to MonarchRaiser's comment.

    Hi @MonarchRaiser

    We've been working them out yet. Please, be patient, we have to make the last edits and add some pictures. When they are finished, you can find them right in the classification page (hopefully).

    Please, cross your fingers and hope it won't take much time to finish it:]

    Zuzi

    Posted

  • Nickypeng by Nickypeng moderator

    Hello DZM
    Zooniverse got a mention on Australian's ABC radio program The Science Show Science show
    Zooniverse was mentioned for how they actively involve their participants by enabling them to talk to each other and the scientists, rather than just using them as slave labour.
    I though you might like to know that the talk system (well, the concept anyway!) is highly regarded.
    I think the Science Show's presenter must be a Zooniverse fan - he has mentioned it several times recently.
    N&P

    Posted

  • DZM by DZM admin

    Hey, thanks for letting me know! That's a really awesome mention of the whole Zooniverse.

    Here's the excerpt, if anyone else is interested:

    Jennifer Shirk: That feedback loop is really critical, and many
    organisations work to not just give feedback but to provide ways for
    the public to be more closely involved in the research process. Again,
    like the Bellybutton Biodiversity and inviting people in to
    understanding what the data mean. And it's a hard thing for scientists
    to do, and that's one of the things that citizen science can really
    provide, is an opportunity to really make those closer connections
    with the public, to not just share but to listen and to learn.

    Robyn Williams: That can be a problem when you've got, as Chris
    Lintott has in Oxford doing Galaxy Zoo, he's got a million people
    helping them. How do you give feedback to a million?

    Jennifer Shirk: Some of that feedback happens right amongst the
    participants themselves. The Zooniverse, Galaxy Zoo being one example
    of a project there, has amazing platforms where participants in these
    projects are sharing questions and observations with each other and
    have provided some great insights into the science that can happen
    because they bring attention to things that they are seeing that
    scientists themselves may have overlooked.

    Robyn Williams: Yes indeed...

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator

    Hey, everyone! 😃

    @TED91 from Disk Detective has created this awesome GOOGLE MAP for the whole Zooniverse community to share where we live.

    There's no need to have a Google account or be logged in. You can place a flag either anonymously, or write your user name or real name to the flag, and projects you contribute to.

    For now, there's just a single layer for all, but more layers could be added and a different colour assigned to each project, or they could be separated to Space, Nature and Other projects, if we wanted, so you could take a look only to those projects you are interested in.

    Have a look, maybe you'll find your neighbour being hooked by the same Zooniverse project!! 😉

    https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=ztJxn9tikpWs.kcO0O-iLLUQ8

    Feel free to add your pin! 😉

    For discussing the map, visit the general Zooniverse Talk here: https://www.zooniverse.org/talk/13/11661?comment=29456&page=1

    Cheers!

    Zuzi

    Posted

  • AvastMH by AvastMH moderator

    oh wow - that's interesting 😄 - we've had one of these on OldWeather for a while...great idea to try layering them! Must see if I can find the OW one...back soon...

    Yep - here it is http://goo.gl/maps/Z2IsJ The inventor was PommyStuart on OW. I've dropped him a note to let him know that the idea has a 'Zooniversal' match 😄

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator in response to AvastMeHearties!'s comment.

    Oh, nice! 😃 Thanks.

    Posted

  • stuartjudith by stuartjudith

    Penguin watch - photographs coming in so slowly you could make a cup of tea while you wait for the next one. This has been happening for the past week or so, is there a problem.
    l have been watching for a good year now and this hasn't happened before.
    thank you.

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator in response to stuartjudith's comment.

    I'm sorry to hear that, @stuartjudith I haven't noticed that personally, but can ask others... Is it just PW images or some other Zooniverse projects? Thanks!

    Posted

  • AvastMH by AvastMH moderator

    Ouch! that sounds like a bad thing stuartjudtih, like Yshish I'm sorry to hear it. Can add a question to Yshish's reply - what browser are you using, and what computer system (Windows/ Apple Mac etc)
    Best wishes.

    Posted

  • gardenmaeve by gardenmaeve moderator

    Oh dear! Sorry to hear that, @stuartjudith. It often is helpful to clear history and cookies. Have you tried that? 😃

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator

    Hey, I'm leaving for a two-week fieldwork in mountains (away from civilisation, lots of snow, no penguins) on Sunday early morning, and probably won't be able to get online much, if at all.. I will miss the project there. Luckily, we have other wonderful moderators here, so you shouldn't be missing me at all! 😉

    Posted

  • gardenmaeve by gardenmaeve moderator

    We'll imagine you having a great adventure, @yshish,. while we count penguins like crazy until your return! 😃

    Posted

  • coldcounter by coldcounter

    Have a great time @yshish I am sure there will still be plenty to count when you get back !! You are going cold turkey for a fortnight and I will be "cut off" for a month ...

    whatever will we do without PW !! 😄

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator

    Thank you, ladies 😃 I'll be busy counting chickillions of children lost in snow and low clouds there 😄 Lets hope their camouflage won't be as good as the penguins'.

    @coldcunter Not sure what you meant by that cold turkey fortnight thing and the cut off.. but I've just received an information that I should be able to get online after midnight, if necessary:] Hope it is a true information......

    Posted

  • gardenmaeve by gardenmaeve moderator

    yshish- Two idioms in English. The "cold turkey" refers to suddenly being cut off from something one is addicted to. As for "cut off", I suspect coldcounter is talking about her upcoming trip to the Antarctic- is that the "cut off" you meant, @coldcounter?

    I've herded children many times. You have delights and frustrations ahead, as I'm sure you know. What a wonderful experience for the children! They are fortunate to have you.

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator in response to gardenmaeve's comment.

    Thanks, @gardenmaeve That's about the same what I guessed it could mean 😃

    Posted

  • coldcounter by coldcounter in response to yshish's comment.

    Yes, that is what I meant, sorry - I forget that English isn't everyone's first language and then I go and use Australian slang it doesn't make it easy for you @yshish ! One of the things that make PW so powerful that even with language barriers we are achieving so much. @gardenmaeve is right in what I meant. The ship has very limited internet access and it isn't for activities such as PW. So I will be "cut off" from it for the duration .... it is VERY EXPENSIVE ($20US for one Kilobyte) of simple email messaging with no attachments....

    Enjoy herding the children .... you are moulding the future thinkers 😃 😃

    Posted

  • gardenmaeve by gardenmaeve moderator

    Our yshish taking her students on a field work trip

    Posted

  • gardenmaeve by gardenmaeve moderator

    By the way, coldcounter, those terms are both common in most English-speaking regions, so no worries! Since I know yshish is very skilled in language comprehension in non-native languages, I was mostly thinking of other volunteers when I posted my wee explanation.

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator in response to gardenmaeve's comment.

    Haha, that is really funny! Although, the mine are much more evil 😄 Thank you, @gardenmaeve

    Posted

  • gardenmaeve by gardenmaeve moderator

    You're welcome, yshish.

    Your little challenges will remember your care of them, and your kindness, and maybe your great sense of humour!

    Posted

  • coldcounter by coldcounter

    No worries @gardenmaeve feel free to translate my slang any time 😃 😃 and I love your interpretation of yshish and her "charges" ...... priceless 😄 😄

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator

    Merry Christmas to everyone! 😃

    Here's a picture from my fieldwork I made escpecially for you!

    pw

    Cheers,

    Zuzi

    Posted

  • AvastMH by AvastMH moderator

    Zuzi! You are very kind to show us the rare European Christmas Penguin! They look to be very interesting 😄

    Have a very very happy Christmas!

    Wishing you many happy pebbles...

    Joan

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator

    😄 And here is a great picture of Dr. Ali from Zooniverse and her penguin, made during her fieldwork on South Georgia.

    I copied it from today's Zooniverse Advent calendar!

    ali

    Posted

  • AvastMH by AvastMH moderator

    Now I wish we had snow in the UK so that I could have a go at building one of Ali's excellent snow penguins!! Thank you Dr Ali!!

    Posted

  • Erin101 by Erin101

    Hello people.

    Im new hete. And am having issue no pictures are loading , i can see thebut guestion on if there are penguins in this picture ...........

    Posted

  • gardenmaeve by gardenmaeve moderator

    Welcome, @Erin101 - This is not the best place for your post. Please follow this link to the Help section, Bug List

    Gardenmaeve

    Posted

  • yshish by yshish moderator, translator

    Hey everyone, I am finally back from vacation 😃 According to the statistics we're 97% done with the current data set which is awesome! I am happy to hear there are still some pictures to classify although it would be so cool if we were finished completely 😄 Let's make it happen, all together!

    Posted

  • gardenmaeve by gardenmaeve moderator

    Welcome back, @yshish ! We're tapping away, working through the rest of the photographs!

    Posted

  • AvastMH by AvastMH moderator

    Tap click tap click tap 😄 Just another 202 taps or clicks before I've finished another 'Alpengarten' 😄

    Posted

  • 2005Penguins by 2005Penguins

    Hi
    Who here loves PENGUINS?

    Posted

  • AvastMH by AvastMH moderator in response to 2005Penguins's comment.

    Well if we could shout, 2005Penguins, you would be deaf by now! We all LOVE and ADORE penguins here. They are wonderful birds and very beautiful to watch. Aren't we lucky to see them so close? Dr Hart is heading off to Antartica very soon to sort out the cameras for another year 😄
    Happy counting penguins!

    Best wishes, AvastMeHearties 😄

    Posted